This topic covers a lot of areas –

But basicly what are the ‘optium’ relationships we should have

between handlebars, seat, and foot pegs ..

Seat size, shape and softness

Hand controls (brake lever, clutch leaver)

Foot controls

All of the above will change from one human to another .. but there will be an average ..

I've had some RSI in the wrists that make me concentrate on that area - basicly I am best off with the straight lind formed by my lower arm inline with my wirsts - no angle other than straight through is best for me.

I like a relationship that makes going from a sitting position to a standing position too, mostly that is the foot peg to seat thing for me. Seat to bars tend to affect my neck/shoulders..

I'd prefer handle bar widths to be 700 mm ... but that is so they fit through doorways rather than ergonomics!

There is not much information on the web about this topic .. more looks to be said about snowmobiles ..
From Ergonomic aspects on snowmobile driving. [Arctic Med Res. 1994] - PubMed Result "The driving positions probably giving the most health problems are sitting with bent back, hyperlordotic neck (too curved), too high upper arms, more or less straight elbows and flexed and ulnar deviated wrist positions."

On back ache from the hubb http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...ack-pain-28106

One persons ideas Motorcycle Ergonomics, Sampson Long Distance Motorcycle Products

Another page - shame about the adds - popup warning Motorcycle Ergonomics: Getting That Kink Out

I know there are a few postings about seats too on the HUBB ..

My own view is you should be comfortable on the bike, be able to ride a whole day, repeat and repeat again without pain or discomfort .. any pain or discomfort says you and the bike are not getting along and something needs to be done. Stretching before and after a ride can help ..

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Regards Frank Warner
motorcycles BMW R80 G/S 1981, BMW K11LT 1993, BMW K75 G/S

I have to say if you want an ergonomic (for teh rider) bike avoid BMW's.

the foot pegs are not opposite one another but the right one is several inches behind the left. This induces a sort of twist in your spine. This effectively means your right arm needs to be longerthan your left to have equal reach on the bars.
The gear and brake pedals are too close to the cylinders and their positions compromised by their proximity. You cant lift your foot and stomp on the rear brake but have to wriggle it under the cylinder and carburrettor to push down with ankle action only. To get around this they have lifted the engine and gearbox up o they are now above the wheel spindles in order to create room under the cylinders for your feet. ( albeit still at odd distances). This makes the quarter ton plus bike top heavy.
Every other bike I have had the petrol lever always had a pointer pointing to the off/open inscribed on the tap. The bmw uses the lever itself to point to the position, not the pointer.
the light switch also uses the switch handle to point to the function, instead of the pointer end.
However the machinery works, but nowhere on the bike will you find any compromise where the riders ergonomics won out over the engineers preferred option.

With my Tiger apart from resetting gear and foot brake lever I have found it to be really good. Throttle paddle? on throttle for long distance cruising so I can relax my grip and stretch my fingers works a treat.

On my Tenere I had to change the handle bars. They were really uncomfortable. What I did was went into my local shop. Pulled all the handle bars of the rack, sat in a chair and held onto them, one at a time that is.

In a sitting position hold your arms out in front of you with elbows slightly bent, let your wrists relax and that is the position you are looking for. Go through all those handle bars till you find a set that coincides with that angle and bingo there are your new handle bars.

Took me about half an hour. By then I had a short list so I took them out and sat on the bike holding the bars in roughly the right position, discarding until I found THE set. Did a shit load of ks on that bike and never had another wrist problem.

With the gear and foot brake lever I have them set so that in my natural riding position both levers are level with the soles of my boots. Suits me anyway.

And I love my sheepskin.

Handle bar levers should be sloping down so that in your normal riding position you can flick your fingers onto the levers without having to roll your wrist back. Once again this is how I'm set up and 1000k runs down the Hume highway (between Sydney and Melbourne) are not a problem.

Cheers
Wilky

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We've taken a vow of poverty. To annoy us, send money.

For fast road riding I want my arse up, weight on my wrists and head low.

For dirt I want to be standing with high bars, levers parallel and gear change high.

For city riding I want flat wide bars and moderate weight on my wrists.

That's the trouble with bikes. I don't think there is an optimum. There might be a compomise that suits you best though.

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The horizontal distance from pegs to bars makes a big difference too. Riding my old drz off road I found the stock position very uncomfortable with lots of strain on fore arms when climbing, and a stiff neck from being hunched forward. Higher bars and standard bar risers did little to improve this. What really helped was ofset bar risers that moved the bars forward. Many dirt bikes now have more than one hole in the yokes so that you can attach the bars in different positions. On older bikes there is frequently a free fix available as the bar clamps are often not symmetrical. Just remove the bars, loosen the clamps and spin them round, then put it all back together. Obviously you need to check nothing fouls and the controls still work properly.

I think it's only fair to just point out that this is "Airheads" you are talking about, so anybody reading not familiar with BMWs should note this is pre 1995(ish). After 95, "Oilheads", totally different bikes.

(Just for the record I find my standard 1978 BMW comfortable, even consecutive 3/400 mile days )

You are quite right, I am referring to my 1985 R80RT, have no experience of other BMW's.

Believe me, as a tall rider, no bike's foot levers are ever in reasonable places. Luckily, both shift and rear brake levers are adjustable on every bike I've ridden. Just move the rear brake lever down. It won't reduce your ground clearance because, unless you bent it out, it hugs the side of the bike. Moving it up or down doesn't change ground clearance to the side, which is what matters when leaning. Your pegs will touch down long before the lever.

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Matt John

I like my gear lever pointing to the middle of my boot, so it's equal effort up or down, and my brake lever sitting just under it, so it's a quick push, no hunting required.

And that works fine on my 86 GS, and every other bike I've ever owned. I've helped hundreds of people set their bikes up in my ergonomics classes, and we've always been able to get them set up right FOR ONE SET OF RIDING CONDITIONS.

Dual sport bikes are the biggest hassle - getting them to work well for street and off-road can be tough, if not impossible - sometimes you have to compromise, or adjust when switching.

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Grant Johnson
Seek, and ye shall find.
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Inspiring, Informing and Connecting travellers since 1997!
www.HorizonsUnlimited.com

Grant, I've noticed that you have a session planned for Enniskillen, but didn't see one on the programme for Ripley. I know that Ripley is a very busy time for both you and Susan, but are you considering one of your classes for there too?

Hadn't really thought of it - but will look at adding it on. Thanks for the interest!

Note that the ergonomics session is on the DVD's!

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Grant Johnson
Seek, and ye shall find.
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Inspiring, Informing and Connecting travellers since 1997!
www.HorizonsUnlimited.com

[QUOTE=Frank Warner;212026]This topic covers a lot of areas –

But basicly what are the ‘optium’ relationships we should have

between handlebars, seat, and foot pegs ..

Seat size, shape and softness

Hand controls (brake lever, clutch leaver)

Foot controls

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Everyone seems to be talking about handlebar, levers, and foot pegs, which is fine and important to get right -- we are all different sizes, shapes and weights. Moreover, bikes are all different, too, so it will be a different setup for each rider.
However, for seats there may be one common denominator: while we can all choose a different seat shape and stuffing, I read somewhere that every adult has a seven inch distance between their sitting bones in their butt -- a freaky fact, considering how different we all appear to be -- I read this on a motorcycle seat-makers site. So, when choosing a seat for distance, 9 inches wide in the sitting part of the seat is said to be optimum (although a scalloped/tapering middle is of course prefered for standing).
Please correct me if that information is incorrect. And of course, actually TRY any seat out before you buy one.